Author Topic: MS Access 2013 and EAP files  (Read 34875 times)

Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #45 on: April 15, 2016, 07:02:07 pm »
OK, so as an Information Architect who's concerned about words (and their meanings and usages), I may be able to provide a somewhat definitive and (I believe) totally consistent answer.

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'stralin is Kiwi for Strayn.  We're obviously better educated and more literate, and know how to use an apostrophe for contraction's rather than just pluralising word's :-)

Except that you DON'T use apostrophes for making nouns plural. Apostrophes are used for contractions (as in don't) and for indicating the possessive of an object OTHER THAN 'it' - Brown's car, the dog's breakfast, but never it's possession. Oh - in their guise as single quotes, they are also used to mark 'borrowed' words in a different context, and for indirect quotations (those that do not have an implied 'he said' or 'he wrote' before or after them).
Having watched Glassboy's pronouncements over time, I was prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt and assumed he was writing ironically (word's for words)

Abbreviation: A shortened or contracted form of a word or phrase (term), used to represent the whole.
Abbreviations come in many forms:  Contractions, Reductions, Initialisms and Acronyms (and Symbols).
A contraction is where the start and end of the word remain (such as Dr for Doctor).
A reduction is where one or other end of the word is "lopped off" (such as etc. for Et Ceterea - incidentally, if you've ever wondered why MS word isnsists on puitting a full stop after etc.  its because (in English) reductions get a full stop to indicate the lopping off and contractions DON'T; so "Dr." is incorrect).
Initialisms are those terms formed by using the initial leters of the words, where you don't pronounce the result as a word - such as FBI
Acronyms are like intialisms except you pronounce the word - such as RADAR RAdio Detection And Ranging.  Acronyms can include other letters to aid in pronunciation.
Symbols are very short terms used to indicate a longer term such as AU for Australian in AU$ or Cu for Copper.

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And as I type this, I notice that you have corrected your post. Look, he DID abuse an apostrophe, honest, he did HE DID!    :->

Edit: Or was that Mr KP doing a clean up? Actually, since KP and I are both of English extraction, this says nothing about the Australian 'way with words'. Perhaps a dinky-die Australian could chip in with some limpid prose to refute that fellow from across the Tasman?
'Tis another use fo the apostrophe to indicate letters dropped or removed for reductions in addition to contractions - otherwise how could you tell that the first letter you see is actually NOT the first letter.

So "'strain' although somewhat obtuse is acceptable as the apostrophe alludes to the "sotto voce" missing "Au".  'Strain differentiates the word from the word strain - with it's normal meaning.

HTH,
Paolo
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bholtzman

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #46 on: April 15, 2016, 10:26:13 pm »
Since you guys already hijacked the thread (I know - I started it!)...Geert I know a number of Dutch air traffic controllers both in Amsterdam and Rotterdam, as well as some at Maastricht. And they all have that same challenge with the language since we use English in all business. My hat is off to all of you!

Bill

RoyC

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #47 on: April 18, 2016, 02:14:10 pm »
Sorry to pontificate, but I am duty bound to report that Glassboy's post further back in this thread was, in fact correct in its punctuation (although I am still not certain about whether he was being serious or facetious in the actual text...). It turns out that SOMEbody added the apostrophes where they didn't ought to have been added. So my deepest apologies.

Paolo, on the other hand:
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'Strain differentiates the word from the word strain - with it's normal meaning.

Now was that you being facetious - or even fatuous - or did SOMEbody enact some corruption there too?
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Glassboy

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #48 on: April 18, 2016, 02:40:11 pm »
I was being facetious.  You can find abuses of the language on both sides of the ditch.  I do notice youse being used as a plural for you more when I'm in Straya, but that maybe because it is more noticeable when hearing it in another accent.

Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #49 on: April 18, 2016, 05:17:28 pm »
Sorry to pontificate, but I am duty bound to report that Glassboy's post further back in this thread was, in fact correct in its punctuation (although I am still not certain about whether he was being serious or facetious in the actual text...). It turns out that SOMEbody added the apostrophes where they didn't ought to have been added. So my deepest apologies.

Paolo, on the other hand:
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'Strain differentiates the word from the word strain - with it's normal meaning.

Now was that you being facetious - or even fatuous - or did SOMEbody enact some corruption there too?
Nope, just typo on a moving bus and insufficient checking  and or rogue spell check....
At least nobody assumed it was that way because I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT WAS CORRECT...


Paolo
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KP

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2016, 05:25:35 pm »
I do notice youse being used as a plural for you more when I'm in Straya, but that maybe because it is more noticeable when hearing it in another accent.
It's more common in country areas than the capital cities. I'm sure I would find it very useful, but unfortunately it (like its US equivalent y'all) can't be spoken un-self-conciously in an English accent.
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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2016, 05:32:50 pm »
I do notice youse being used as a plural for you more when I'm in Straya, but that maybe because it is more noticeable when hearing it in another accent.
It's more common in country areas than the capital cities. I'm sure I would find it very useful, but unfortunately it (like its US equivalent y'all) can't be spoken un-self-consciously in an English accent.
It's also a Bogan (predominantly Western Sydney and Melbourne) pride term...  As in Jeff Fenech's: "I loves youse all!"


It's not used so much in the Western third of the West Island.


Paolo
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... Therefore, aim for consistency; in the expectation of achieving correctness....
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Glassboy

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #52 on: April 19, 2016, 08:24:36 am »
I do notice youse being used as a plural for you more when I'm in Straya, but that maybe because it is more noticeable when hearing it in another accent.
It's more common in country areas than the capital cities. I'm sure I would find it very useful, but unfortunately it (like its US equivalent y'all) can't be spoken un-self-conciously in an English accent.

I find y'all quaint and endearing and I am always delighted when someone manages to use it twice in one sentence.  Youse (ewes) - on the other hand - are sheep.

bholtzman

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #53 on: May 05, 2016, 11:08:53 pm »
Paolo and all,
We've established a Postgres database on our server and migrated an EAP file into it. We then connect to the database from both EA and a custom Access front end. After some performance tuning of my code, it all seems to work quite well. My table and code configurations are such that we don't do any data manipulation on the EA tables but only on the custom tables I created. So I feel like we've minimized the risk of bad things happening and still leveraged the power of your approach.

It's really quite an effective solution to our needs and fits well with our existing skill sets. I do hope to graduate one day to Geert's more sophisticated and intrinsic solution but the current configuration is what will enable us to get the resources required for that.

We want to provide users with only the run-time MS Access to use the custom front end. If they had the full version of Access they could create the connection to the database themselves, but with the run-time version I understand I need to code the connection in VB. Do you have any tips or code snippets on doing this? Maybe this wasn't an issue for you but I figured it was worth asking.

Thanks for all of your help!

Bill

Glassboy

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #54 on: May 06, 2016, 06:48:37 am »
We've established a Postgres database on our server and migrated an EAP file into it. We then connect to the database from both EA and a custom Access front end. After some performance tuning of my code, it all seems to work quite well. My table and code configurations are such that we don't do any data manipulation on the EA tables but only on the custom tables I created. So I feel like we've minimized the risk of bad things happening and still leveraged the power of your approach.

I've had some issues in the past with Postgres based repositories, especially migrating off them.  Given what you're doing, I'd suggest you test a transfer to an EAP based repository just to make sure you haven't accidently locked yourself in (as it were).

bholtzman

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #55 on: May 06, 2016, 10:43:32 pm »
Hi GB,
We did that and it seems to have turned out fine. I also published to HTML and that went fine. I didn't do any comprehensive testing though. Is there anything in particular we should be looking for in terms of problems with migration?

All in all we haven't had any issues so far except for performance over the VPN from far away.

Bill

Glassboy

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #56 on: May 09, 2016, 07:36:04 am »
Hi GB,
We did that and it seems to have turned out fine. I also published to HTML and that went fine. I didn't do any comprehensive testing though. Is there anything in particular we should be looking for in terms of problems with migration?

I've seen a couple of really strange errors that looked like some type mismatch on exports, but as my only access to the database was a 32bit ODBC client that needed shimming to work on what was already a broken Windows 7 build it was rather hard to work out what was going on.

bholtzman

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #57 on: May 20, 2016, 03:33:14 am »
Does anyone know how to code an ODBC connection into the Access file? We'd like users to be able to run the app with the run-time version, which doesn't allow them to configure the connection. Just hoping someone has some copy-and-paste and save me the trouble...

Bill

qwerty

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #58 on: May 20, 2016, 05:27:30 am »
Use File/Open. From the context menu of an existing connection choose Edit connection string.

q.

bholtzman

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Re: MS Access 2013 and EAP files
« Reply #59 on: October 09, 2016, 02:42:43 am »
I have to tell you guys, using MS Access with an EA Postgres database has been working out great. I have so much flexibility in terms of customizing the Access front-end, adding and modifying my custom data tables, and customizing the output capabilities it is tremendous. Even if I knew how to build MDG Technologies, I am not sure I'd have the same ease-of-use that I have and it would have taken me months if not more to get to the same level of proficiency. It helped, of course, that I had years of experience with Access. But I really am skeptical that I could have achieved the same level of capability with MDG Technologies even if I had mastered them.

I haven't had any issues with corrupting the database or any other setback. Naturally I am diligently and religiously careful never to touch the EA native tables. The only issues I have are performance-related when I am using a VPN connection. Most functions work well but when Access does heavy data crunching, as most of you know, it passes lots of data back and forth with the database. So one procedure - when I review all of the EA changes and build a new data dictionary - can take as long as a half hour to run. But it's an issue that's very workable and a small price to pay for the powerful tool I have built.

Well, I just wanted to update you on my efforts and let you know that this method does indeed have value despite your misgivings. You just have to be careful and know what you're doing, as I think Paolo said previously. Thanks, Paolo!

Bill