Author Topic: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?  (Read 1122 times)

Geert Bellekens

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2019, 10:59:04 pm »
I can definitely agree the the database is a big mess. :-\

In part because at some point they decided not to change the database structure anymore. It is virtually unchanged since 2005.
All the new stuff has been stuffed in other places such as t_xref, t_document.
In other places they used some fields to add key/value pairs (e.g. StyleEx fields) or xml strings.

The positive thing about that is that you can open a model from 2005 with version 15, and vice versa, you can open a model created with version 15 with EA version 6.5

Geert

timoc

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2019, 05:47:05 pm »
@timoc Why didn't you open your own thread? Our "improvement rants" (or whatever they can be called) are more related with the OP's intention than what I see from your question - which I still don't get.

q.
Yeh, I'm way off topic. I do plan post a thread once i have gotten it to do something usefull that i can share, and i will start another thread on the t_document table. "Improvement rants" might need their own forum from what i can see ;)

qwerty

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2019, 07:10:50 pm »
Lots of them. I did poke around in those tables quite a bit. So if you have a specific question, just ask. What I got so far was just that you found it "somewhat inconsistent". Well, I've been there quite some years ago.

q.

timoc

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2019, 06:23:29 pm »
Lots of them. I did poke around in those tables quite a bit. So if you have a specific question, just ask. What I got so far was just that you found it "somewhat inconsistent". Well, I've been there quite some years ago.

q.
In essence, i have spent a good portion of my career as a Software engineer, and Architect working on old codebases, and systems, dragging them kicking and screaming into the light of the 20th and 21st centuries. During that time, i have seen my share of 'red flags'. With all of the best will in the world for the guys and gals on the development team, when i saw a 'Notes' field, containing xml fragments, themselves containing references to SQL element UUID's, alongside a 'Style field with even more element information in XML, in what seems to be a uuid key based lookup table, without database managed referential integrity... That is when i started to twitch :o.

Embedding XML in an SQL table, ok, that is Part 14 of the SQL Specification now, so  :-\, maybe a sign of technical debt, deal with it and move on. This is not that. I now understand how i could have accidentally 'lost' a whole section of my team library.  Specifically, this idea that a database model freeze+new features makes any kind of sense in these days of continuous database development needs to be addressed, I've shelved that rant for later posting when i can say something more constructive, and not sound like i'm just throwing aspersions from the peanut gallery.

qwerty

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2019, 03:00:49 am »
Aw, where should I start my rant about that so-called database then?? If there were a chance I'd go for a visit to Australia I likely should have a bullet proof vest. It won't happen and I really do no longer care.

q.

Glassboy

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2019, 07:13:20 am »
Aw, where should I start my rant about that so-called database then?? If there were a chance I'd go for a visit to Australia I likely should have a bullet proof vest. It won't happen and I really do no longer care.

The spiders, snakes, or beer would likely kill you before you needed to rely on a vest. :-)

timoc

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2019, 08:29:41 pm »
.... I really do no longer care.

q.
Stage 5 - Acceptance :). Not there myself yet.

qwerty

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2019, 06:12:52 pm »
Stage 5 - Acceptance :). Not there myself yet.
Interesting that you come up with Kübler-Ross. But indeed the 5 stages are what I've gone through. Maybe that when realizing the scenario I'd reached it earlier.

q.

timoc

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2019, 07:07:16 pm »
Stage 5 - Acceptance :). Not there myself yet.
Interesting that you come up with Kübler-Ross. But indeed the 5 stages are what I've gone through. Maybe that when realizing the scenario I'd reached it earlier.

q.
Kübler-Ross is a metaphor i was given one time by a colleague who was trying to get me to stop banging my head against a wall of corporate indifference. We did eventually move on to stage 5 in that situation, but if i see a group get angry about something its a go-to model for seeing where people are at. I can tell the old hands here are stage 5, which implies way too much about the EA support model, but i will try to stay at stage 3 for as long as i am using EA :)

qwerty

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2019, 08:29:49 pm »
Death metaphors, which come to mind?
1) Monty Python's parrot sketch ("Listen, I tell you what's wrong with it: it's dead")
2) Tribal wisdom of the Dakota about riding a dead horse
3) Enterprise Architect

I have to think about the order of the list.

q.

timoc

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2019, 09:52:32 pm »
Death metaphors, which come to mind?
1) Monty Python's parrot sketch ("Listen, I tell you what's wrong with it: it's dead")
2) Tribal wisdom of the Dakota about riding a dead horse
3) Enterprise Architect

I have to think about the order of the list.

q.
Ahhh.... there is stage 4 ;)
I always refer to the 5 stages [denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance] as the 5 stages of grief. I'm sure there is a bigger list of grief generating topics  ;D

I honestly did not know it was about grief over death until needed a link for that earlier thread.

skiwi

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #26 on: July 03, 2019, 01:57:23 pm »

It occurred to me that it would be cool to extend the [Alt+Z] functionality to resize the enclosing item to the set of enclosed items (with a default margin).  If the enclosing item has a name, the enclosure should begin below the name.
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Orthogonality rules
Using EA14.0 (1422) on Windows 10 Enterprise/64 bit. Repositories in SQLServer2014 R2 & Access2003/JET4.0

Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #27 on: July 11, 2019, 05:54:39 pm »
Wow!

Having been on holiday in Central and Northern Australia for the last month and literally off-the-air for most of it (my wife didn't believe I could survive without the Internet  ;D), my original post seems to have stirred up a hornets' nest!

Anyway, one of my aphorisms is:  "Using EA in spite of EA; not because of it!"  While it is still true, the balance is shifting.

We can but live in hope...  My hope is that Sparx decides to harness the evident goodwill in the customer base.

The positive thing about that is that you can open a model from 2005 with version 15, and vice versa, you can open a model created with version 15 with EA version 6.5

Geert
Sounds like asking motor vehicles to respond to buggy whips.

Sometimes you just need to move on...  In any case, while you can open the file, the semantics are quite different and thus the exercise is (effectively) pointless.  (Yes Geert (Joyce), I know you were being sarcastic).

If Sparx asked the user base about usage, they might get a surprise (since they don't appear to have instrumentation and telemetry), they are flying a bit blind, surely?

Paolo
« Last Edit: July 11, 2019, 05:58:30 pm by Paolo F Cantoni »
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... Therefore, aim for consistency; in the expectation of achieving correctness....
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qwerty

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Re: Extend [Alt+Z] to include Visual Enclosure?
« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2019, 08:38:48 pm »
Yee-haw!

q.