Author Topic: v15 tagged values  (Read 607 times)

MaXyM

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v15 tagged values
« on: May 16, 2019, 11:14:19 pm »
It seems that in v15, tagged values are sub window (tab) of properties window.
I found more comfortable to have separate window for properties and taggedvalues. Is it possible to achieve the same in v15?
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 12:48:30 am by MaXyM »

Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2019, 08:18:29 am »
It seems that in v15, tagged values are sub window (tab) of properties window.
I found more comfortable to have a separate window for properties and tagged values. Is it possible to achieve the same in v15?
That's not completely true.  Those Tags defined in the MDG as "properties" of the element are located in the Element Window.  I think that's an improvement.

Paolo
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Eve

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2019, 09:46:48 am »
We've promoted stereotype properties to be with the rest of the properties for the element. Tagged values not associated with a profile are still available as a separate tab with the intentionally diminutive label of tags.

So what you see is that the properties from stereotypes are up front and center. Even better, they get the same priority on connectors, attributes and operations.
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2019, 10:14:26 am »
We've promoted stereotype properties to be with the rest of the properties for the element. Tagged values not associated with a profile are still available as a separate tab with the intentionally diminutive label of tags.

So what you see is that the properties from stereotypes are up front and center. Even better, they get the same priority on connectors, attributes and operations.
As mentioned below, I support moving the Metatype (Stereotype) Property tags away from the general tags for the new Element Properties Window.  But PLEASE display the metatype NOT the stereotype.  Our stereotypes are cryptic, not user-friendly.  Displaying the stereotype is NOT in-line with Sparx's movement to metatype based displays.

Reported,
Paolo
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Geert Bellekens

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2019, 01:59:44 pm »
The annoying thing about this change is that I cannot keep the focus on the tags (as I could with the docked tagged values window)
So if I now need to check the tagged values of a series of elements I each time have to click on the "Tags" tab in the properties window.

Geert

MaXyM

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2019, 06:19:12 pm »
Exactly what Geert said.
I found it uncomfy for the same reason.

Eve

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2019, 09:54:57 am »
The annoying thing about this change is that I cannot keep the focus on the tags (as I could with the docked tagged values window)
So if I now need to check the tagged values of a series of elements I each time have to click on the "Tags" tab in the properties window.

Geert

I'd encourage you to start moving towards a profile to contain those properties instead of adding ad-hoc tags to all of your elements.

However, the window is supposed to remember which tab you have open. (My complaint is that it's too specific, remembering it for each type/stereotype pair) It appears that isn't working properly for the Tags.
Eve

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Geert Bellekens

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2019, 01:36:46 pm »
I'd encourage you to start moving towards a profile to contain those properties instead of adding ad-hoc tags to all of your elements.
I do wherever possible, but there are situation where that isn't an option
- multiple tagged values with the same name
- traceability tags added by an add-in such as EA Message Composer or EA Mapping. In these cases I don't want to add a stereotype to the elements, only a tagged value to reference another part of the model (Element, attribute, association)

Geert


Sunshine

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #8 on: May 20, 2019, 05:24:42 pm »
I like the idea of having tags with stereotypes appearing as part of the object in V15 beta. However I noticed there is a slight difference in displaying these. With our MDG we cluster the tags together groups which display fine in V14.1 however, these groups are no longer displayed making the list of tags less comprehensible.
Happy to help
:)

Eve

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2019, 08:46:51 am »
Sunshine, I wasn't sure what grouping was missing. But I think there's been a bug report describing a the same issue.

In that case, the grouping was that the stereotypes within the inheritance hierarchy for a given stereotype used to be in individual groups.

Is that your issue?

I don't think inheritance necessarily translates to good UI grouping. But it is possible to group tagged values still, it's just specified explicitly.

https://www.sparxsystems.com/enterprise_architect_user_guide/15.0/modeling/define_tag_groupings.html

If you want to, you could even use that to recreate the groups in 14.
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2019, 09:47:32 am »
[SNIP]

https://www.sparxsystems.com/enterprise_architect_user_guide/15.0/modeling/define_tag_groupings.html

If you want to, you could even use that to recreate the groups in 14.
Thanks for the reminder, Eve.  I'd noticed it, "en passant", on the BPMN MDG (which I don't use much at present in my current role) but didn't take much notice ("other fish to fry").

However, with the number of Tags associated with some of our elements approaching the numbers mentioned for the BPMN Activity, it bears re-appraisal.

I'm intrigued as to the syntax of the _tagGroupings element.  The syntax seems to be <TagName>=<Grouping Name>.  This forces the groups to be specified as individual mappings, rather than using (to me) a more intuitive syntax of <Grouping Name>=<TagName1>,<TagName2>,<TagName3>.
Can you indicate the rationale?  (As you can see there's no <rhetoricalquestion> wrapper.  ;) -  I'm truly interested.)

Paolo

PS:  I assume one can use the same grouping name in multiple elements - each customised for that element.  Can you confirm?
Conversely, is it possible to define a named grouping in one place and use it in multiple elements?
Given the current syntax, can the same tag appear in more than one grouping?
« Last Edit: May 21, 2019, 09:51:46 am by Paolo F Cantoni »
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Sunshine

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2019, 09:01:55 pm »
Sunshine, I wasn't sure what grouping was missing. But I think there's been a bug report describing a the same issue.
Yes that would be me :)
In that case, the grouping was that the stereotypes within the inheritance hierarchy for a given stereotype used to be in individual groups.

Is that your issue?
Yes that's right.
I don't think inheritance necessarily translates to good UI grouping. But it is possible to group tagged values still, it's just specified explicitly.
https://www.sparxsystems.com/enterprise_architect_user_guide/15.0/modeling/define_tag_groupings.html
If you want to, you could even use that to recreate the groups in 14.
May be you are right about the inheritance used as convenience for grouping and re-using attributes in elements and across other elements. I started an Archimate based MDG back in 2007 and sometime between then now the number of attributes on elements became too large on a few elements like work package and application component so I needed to group the attributes and the only way I could see how to do it then was via inheritance. Thanks for the reference to show another way of grouping attributes I'll look into that tomorrow.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2019, 09:19:48 am by Sunshine »
Happy to help
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Eve

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2019, 09:29:58 am »
I'm intrigued as to the syntax of the _tagGroupings element.  The syntax seems to be <TagName>=<Grouping Name>.  This forces the groups to be specified as individual mappings, rather than using (to me) a more intuitive syntax of <Grouping Name>=<TagName1>,<TagName2>,<TagName3>.
Can you indicate the rationale?  (As you can see there's no <rhetoricalquestion> wrapper.  ;) -  I'm truly interested.)
The property->group notation prevents ambiguity possible in the group->properties notation. But honestly I'm not sure it was thought through.

PS:  I assume one can use the same grouping name in multiple elements - each customised for that element.  Can you confirm?
Conversely, is it possible to define a named grouping in one place and use it in multiple elements?
Given the current syntax, can the same tag appear in more than one grouping?
Given it's defined on the metaclass you could use it across multiple stereotypes, but there are other reasons why you're unlikely to do that.

No, each property should only appear in a single group.
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15 tagged values
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2019, 09:49:28 am »
I'm intrigued as to the syntax of the _tagGroupings element.  The syntax seems to be <TagName>=<Grouping Name>.  This forces the groups to be specified as individual mappings, rather than using (to me) a more intuitive syntax of <Grouping Name>=<TagName1>,<TagName2>,<TagName3>.
Can you indicate the rationale?  (As you can see there's no <rhetoricalquestion> wrapper.  ;) -  I'm truly interested.)
The property->group notation prevents ambiguity possible in the group->properties notation. But honestly, I'm not sure it was thought through.
I don't understand the difference in ambiguity in the different forms.  Can you elucidate?  Both forms reduce to the <TagName>=<Grouping Name> tuple.  Once you postulate uniqueness of the intersector, you need to check both forms for possible duplicates.
Quote
PS:  I assume one can use the same grouping name in multiple elements - each customised for that element.  Can you confirm?
Conversely, is it possible to define a named grouping in one place and use it in multiple elements?
Given the current syntax, can the same tag appear in more than one grouping?
Given it's defined on the metaclass you could use it across multiple stereotypes, but there are other reasons why you're unlikely to do that.
But that metaclass instance is forced into a 1:1 relationship with the stereotype as we've discussed before does it not?
So you can't use it across multiple stereotypes.
Quote
No, each property should only appear in a single group.

Paolo
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